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Communication 31/3/07

 

A new form of literacy? 9/1/06

 

How accessible is my site? I wonder. There is a lot here, and some visitors are impressed by the site so must have got into it and found stuff that interested them, but I don’t get as many comments as I’d like, and I don’t know if that’s because designing a revolution is a minority interest and a peculiar idea, or because the site fails to draw people in.

 

Last weekend I watched as someone I’d mentioned the project to accessed the site and looked around – very tentatively. It was painful to watch him not exploring the site, not moving his mouse, not looking for links. I mentioned this to someone else, and he said that the internet requires a new form of literacy. (This is ‘literacy’ per se, and not the same thing as ‘computer literacy’, which goes with an annoying smug self-deprecation from some people: ‘Oh, I’m no good with computers – or technology or “the web” etc. – Smirk,’ the younger sibling of ‘Oh, I’m no good at maths – Smirk’.) Think of the various modes of using books. There’s a world of difference between reading a novel starting at page 1 and reading every page in turn, and using a book in one’s studies, where one looks at contents, index, flips through, dips in, reads parts of the introduction and conclusion, and so on, looking for different things all the time: what kind of book is this? what’s useful? what’s the style? where’s the writer(s) coming from? The latter is obviously more like the new form of literacy the internet requires.

 

The immediate question I have right now is, should I encourage a friend (‘MJ’) who is interested in my ideas to visit my site? She is a nervous user of the internet, so is she going to get anything out of the site? She interests me because she is inclined towards Conservative politicians, sees benefits in public school (in Britain this means fee paying) education, in that it produces people like Zac Goldsmith and Monty Don, and at the same time she is a serious gardener and grows food – see below. As an eco-communist-anarchist (just trying this designation out for size) I’m no more sympathetic towards the ‘left’ in conventional politics than towards the ‘right’. Radicality – perhaps not a valid word – is of much more interest.

 

From MJ, 14 Jan 2006, ‘Where there’s muck there’s magic!’

 

Dear Chris,

I really do enjoy our exchanges and feel inspired to reflect on the views you hold. I must apologize for my possibly irritating tendency to flippancy. We all have our ways of dealing with life!

 

Anyway, after thinking became a little too gloomy I went outside and did some garden clearing and turned the compost heap. Turning the compost heap and excavating for the finished product, which I did a few weeks ago and now have a mountain of rich reddish brown horticultural gold on the middle of my veg plot, are the among the most satisfying activities I can think of. Perhaps I thereby redeem my awful tendency to support wet Conservatives (though I must say that after the report that the favourite tv programme of – what did you call him – David-cheesy-Cameron - is that dreadful Jeremy Clarkson, I am inclined to rethink my position. Or was this just an opposition plot to alienate all right-thinking people from him (DC)? Would like to know!)

love, [MJ]

 

Note: I had actually called him ‘David Posh-and-nice Cameron’, after a cartoon suggesting that’s what people see in him.


Intriguing that people can come across my site (not all get in touch, I imagine)...

10 December 2005

Dear Sir.
 my name is Mr Appaisei.A farmer from Ghana but now Residence in South Africa. i saw ur site online and i will like to know more information about ur work.so try to tell me soemthing about ur intitute.so that we can be friends and plan for future crops.

14 November 2005

Hi Chris,
Just ran across your site. You might find the Australian Democratic Socialists' book, Environment, Capitalism and Socialism (http://www.dsp.org.au/dsp/ECS/index.htm ), of interest.
All the best,
ND.
Also check out Green Left Weekly at http://www.greenleft.org.au


I had an email from AI, which sparked off an exchange (earliest first, or skip to most recent):

23 October 2005

Hey Chris, as a budding permaculturalist with a newly acquired interest in socialism, I was ruminating over the idea of combining the two in a sort of symbiosis.

It was with great joy that I stumbled across your fantastic website!

I too am encouraged by the pragmatic solutions permaculture has to offer us as a positivistic way of dealing with a world in crisis.

One thing though, I am confused about your dropping of, ‘redistribute surplus’ as one of the permaculture ethics. Which I take to mean:

“After achieving our basic needs we can help others to obtain the same” Bill M (I think)

I find this ethic particularly useful as an impetus to action. It motivates me to share what I don’t need, such as giving spare vegetables to neighbors and friends which strengthens the ‘care of people’ ethic. IMO redistribution is a necessary move away from the greed and self interest of a capitalist society.

I am especially interested in city based permaculture gardens being set up as common spaces for community food production and education (currently most examples of permaculture in New Zealand are on private property). If you have any information on such things (or known sources) I would be very grateful if you could shuffle it my way.

Thanks for your website, it is a great resource, and perhaps, an example of redistribution in action.

Lastly, a quote:
"The work of a garden bears visible fruits-in a world where most of our labours seem suspiciously meaningless" Pam Brown b.1928
‘kia koa koe’ wishing you joy,
ana(baby permie of the non-crusty variety)

My reply:

23 October 2005

Hi A, Lovely to hear from you, good to hear my site can be stumbled across. I forget what is there and why I said things, so I'm not sure about 'dropping' the 'redistribute surplus’ ethic; perhaps you can tell me where that appears and I expect I'll remember the point. One minor thing was that people chop and change the way the third ethic is phrased, so one gets the impression that they just like the idea of a threesome - makes a good diagram. But as Mollison said, there is only one ethic anyway, which is earth care; the rest follows. love, Chris

To which A replied:

25 October 2005

Hi Chris, thanks for replying.
I think you said something about the 3rd ethic being preachy, any way that aside do you have any thoughts on Masanobu Fukuoka's practices?
I am reading "the natural way of farming" and finding it fascinating.
love ana

My reply to that:

26 October 2005

Hi A, I had a quick look on my site for refs to ethics & I can't find what I vaguely remember saying about the 3rd one, which can be 'fair shares' (Mollison), 'redistribute surplus’ (which you like) or 'setting limits to population and consumption' (a deep ecology version which I do think is preachy and non-people-caring), and there've been other varients. As for Fukuoka, I was entranced by him in my early days of meeting pc, and it is important to address how we grow staple foods, not just fruit and veg. Years ago I read that organically grown hard milling wheat in this country is shipped from Australia, which is daft. It has been a problem growing hard milling wheat here, but we can grow soft and feed wheat. I think things have improved since I first looked into it, however I've just done a google search and found this: 'there's not enough organic wheat available in the UK to meet the current demand. UK flour millers therefore have to import some organic wheat.' http://www.fabflour.co.uk/Freestyle.asp?PageID=232 As for Fukuoka-style no-dig grain cultivation in the UK and Europe, there have been experiments, but my feeling is that more needs to be done on community/bioregion-wide design with sourcing staples sustainably as a key element. Again, lovely to hear from you. Love, Chris


Long time no comments, on the permaculture side of things anyway. But now that I've got started on 'Design ideas', there've been some on 'Potential abundance', latest dated 17th April 2005.

From Gav, 24/10/04

Hi Chris,

well what an excellent initiation and contribution you have facillitated. thinking about getting permaculture out to working class and poor people, it strikes me that many people are really struggling at the moment, life is very much harder and brutal down at my end of the ladder, subsequently we need to be aware of what free attention working class people have to absorb these ideas. Somehow we need to engage in the immediate issues that interest people and use these as an entry point to start introducing what we know. A big thing is the whole issue of housing, it's nearly impossible for people I know to afford to buy anywhere and also renting has gone through the roof. However, when land becomes available ie brownfield sites, people have no consultation about how and in what type of house they would like to live. It's just the same old crappy, wasteful and compacted little boxes courtesy of the big building magnates.

Prescott recently called for cheap houses for key workers and I think it would be good to challenge him on this, like positively suggesting how great structures can be built sourcing local materials and generally improving any given area.

Also, until recently local authorities built quite a lot of homes for rental which has now totally collapsed but those resourses could and should be utilised to create new houses for people.

Loads of people who can afford to are leaving cities in search of some rural space and harmony and no-one can blame them for that, but the rest of us are left in shabby decaying urban areas which need to be totally reclaimed and regenerated not by outside forces after a quick buck but by local people deciding how they want their community to look like. I think there is tremendous potential in this.

There will probably be a Socialist candidate standing in Southampton in the general election and I will be fighting to get these ideas includes in the manifesto.

I think that it is an exciting challenge thnking about completely overhauling urban areas and we need to get across the point that people actually deserve to live well and comfortably but this needn't be at the expense of the environment.


From GM, 24/10/04

Hi Chris,

Great to hear from you and sorry about the lack of response. Like you I think that permaculture has tremendous potential as an integrated system of living and could probably be utilised lock, stock and barrel by the socialist movement.

I've been a member of the Socialist Party formerly Militant for over 20 years and today meet up with the general secretary at a rally and spoke from the floor about permaculture and I think the way forward for me is to write an article for the theoreticlal journal and invite responses.

By the way there is an interesting pamphlet I got hold of entitled ' planning green growth' by Pete Dickenson which is a socialist contribution to the ongoing discussion about where we are going.

I haven't visited the website as yet and I also need to give your leaflet much more attention than I have done and I'll get back to you afterwards.

What was encouraging about the meeting I refered to earlier is that Peter Taaffe was open to discussion he said that socialists don't have all the answers and was humble enough to recognise the magnificent efforts of people in permaculture and other associated issues who have been trying to get their heads around this thorny issue and come up with some remarkably intelligent and practical solutions.

So all power to you Chris and I look forward to conversing with you again real soon

Best wishes

GM


From MR, 9/10/04

Hallo Chris,

I write painfully slowly, I'm afraid, but the attached essay is the first corner of my ideas on land law - or perhaps the central pillar. If you'd like me to send you more, please let me know - and any comments would be very welcome. But please bear in mind that everything I say about the law is a layman's impression of it - although I've read overviews of it, I haven't studied it in any depth.

Best regards

MR


From MF, 4/10/04

Hallo Chris

It was good to have a chat when you were up in Leeds recently. I've been reading your website since then with much agreement, particularly laying blame at the feet of millenia of broadscale farming; the mis-balance in Permaculture towards the "crusties"; and the need to be smarter in mainstreaming Permaculture.

...

The problem is that permaculture is nothing if it is not backed by experience and accomplishment in all aspects of the human condition. We do not lack for articulators on earthcare. We do have a problem in offering solutions to the 80% of our population that live in urban areas. OK - we can retrofit individual urban lives to lighten their ecological loading, but we are poor at assisting in urban design and community building - the things that make a real difference. We don't connect resource-poor people to the mainstream, or teach them how to organise themselves, allowing them to take on responsibility and have real power. We are not experts in building human and social capital when we should be. We are not positioning ourselves as those agents of change that work with what we have, to bring about the achievable transitions for as many as who need it. We should be community entrepreneurs with mainstream experiences to which we can then bring permaculture thinking and design to bear. We need credibility.

Work done for the permaculture diploma can be the "shopfront" for enhancing this credibility. The reality that opportunities for land design are pretty small for most permaculturists has meant that some people have been reluctant to carry on and work for their diploma. Fortunately, there have been those confident enough to interpret the design requirement as being open to non-land based designs such as organising a public event, being a course convenor or local group co-ordinator; or running a community project etc. Jamie Saunders was one of the first Diploma candidates to base his accreditation in such a way - I didn't, but I should have done. In the last few years, I have been Design Support Tutor to two diploma candidates who did not present on site design, but on various aspects of community building. We need more, and we need to make more of it.

For all this, I strongly support the proposal for your diploma. I suspect that you will need good understanding from the others in your action learning group. Perhaps you may consider an email support group as well, where you can share your ideas and progress and get some feedback. I tend to bash out a polemic as a way of understanding what I am thinking, and then post it on my website if it fits. I also circulate it on the PermacultureUK email discussion group where, once in a blue moon, I might get a response! If you are not a member already, I think you join by sending an email with Subscribe in the title line to permacultureuk1@ntlworld.com. I will be posting details of your website on to the discussion group.

Because I have to feel I am making progress, I want to think about what I could do - with others - that would get some recogintion of Permaculture into the mainstreams that I envisage above. Perhaps I could run it past you later.

All the best for now

MF



From GF, 24/9/04

Hi Chris,

I attended your workshop at the convergence on making pc mainstream friendly and found it very stimulating - hence me looking at your site.( I was the bloke making the argument that every body has too much money and not enough time [at least that is how people behave] and that it will take a shift in priorities coupled by affordability to push people toward a more sustainable existence). I think the site is great and will continue to visit and try to be involved/support with the rev. I have not yet done the design course, (hoping to do A-----’s weekly one as it is affordable - Another thing that precludes the people who could most benfit from pc lifestyle. Cost and time out for people on low income and ltd holiday entitlement esp. if they have a family makes the pc 2 week residential design course out of reach until their children have left home), and have never really thought of myself as a socialist/Marxist, more of an anarchist in theory, although I would call people like John Pilger and Noam Chomsky my heroes, and I identified very much with “reasons to be Cheerful”, by Mark Steele. Check it out it is very funny.

I agree with a lot of what you say in your rant about your problem with permies and have found that this image you prtray so well is a barrier between permaculture and the mainstream - If Permaculture cannot work in an urban environment and be seen as approachable and affordable by millions of poorer working class people with aspirations for a better quality of life then who is it for? Many of my colleagues see it as a lifestyle choice for middle class people who have chosen to drop out of society and can afford to go to the supermarket when their veggies don’t grow!


Regards, GF, X.


From MR 15/9/04

Hallo Chris,

Like you I'm 'selective about whom I respect and want to work with', so I've looked at your site a few times before contacting you. I hope you don't mind me saying, but I am quite put off by labels such as marxist, socialist, capitalist etc; they seem to me to give an illusion of definition in an area where there are no clear boundaries (or perhaps I just don't know what they mean).

You seemed interested in what I said at your workshop, about the need to define one's personal legal code, and about the possibility of bringing about a change in the courts' interpretation of land law. If you would like me to elaborate on those ideas, or would like to hear some of the other thoughts I've had, I would appreciate the opportunity to express them in a dialogue. I have often promised myself to write them all up into a wonderfully coherent, world-changing magnum opus, but I've always been defeated by a blank page, and the decision of where to start - and a feeling that, without putting in a lot of padding, it wouldn't in fact stretch beyond a few pages.

Can I comment on some of what you call your weaknesses (the ones I know well):

'Inclined to think and talk but not do, even write' sounds like "Maximum contemplation; minimum action".

'I have intentions but don't follow them through, or not very far': the more ambitious you are, the harder it is to develop all the tools you need to do your ambitions justice, and the more important it is not to expend your energies in directions that don't contribute to your central purpose. If you unconsciously recognise when your intention is either beyond your current abilities or could lead you away from your main goal, then not following through is a virtue.

Best regards

MR